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Ban Appeal - wingedseraph - 10-20-2024

Server you were banned on (SMP/Discord): Both  Undecided

Minecraft username: wingedseraph

Reason for your ban (exactly what it says when you try to log in!): name calling, using discord to circumvent /ignore and harass a player after being warned by staff to stop

Who banned you: staff

Why should you be unbanned (Why should we give you a second chance?): okay i got a lot to say so i am going to break this up into 3 different sections to address all things against me.

1. name calling- 
jorah has not liked me for a long time, i do not know exactly why, but i have the screenshots from where it started. at first, he was mad at me for playing around with juan and dorito (he said that it was because they don't like each other) but they are both my friends so i don't know what their hatred for each other has to do with me. here is the screenshots[Image: IMG_1176.png?ex=6715307d&is=6713defd&hm=...b0ce0447e&][Image: IMG_1175.png?ex=6715307c&is=6713defc&hm=...acd3ff826&]
in this screenshot, you can see that i thought me and jorah were joking around and i realized that maybe he was not joking around and there were actually hard feelings, so i took the time to apologize and see if he was okay, and if there was bad blood. in return, i was called a twat and was told to leave him alone (which i did!). he ignored me and i did not really care. i did not think he actually hated me, i just thought he was irritable, because i have seen him say rude things to people on the server before and i just left it alone. a while later this screenshot was used against me: [Image: image.png?ex=67153127&is=6713dfa7&hm=e85...dcd1a4664&]
i was told to stop harassing him (which is wack because i work a job and do not have the time to be that invested). and the harassment in question was me seeing his name and saying a joke which i literally just put his name into the song that jewish people sing at hanukkah (love my jewish peeps, amazing song btw). it was 3:56 in the morning and i was high (not an excuse, but an explanation) and tbh i kinda forgot he had me ignored. afterwards i was warned and i took the warning in stride and stopped bothering him. then came this horrid screenshot: [Image: image.png?ex=6715320b&is=6713e08b&hm=82b...eight=1011]which, at the time, when looked at from an isolated event perspective, to everyone in the chat it did look like i was making it about me. NOT A GOOD LOOK. but by then he had said so many things to me that i kind of jumped the gun and assumed it was about me because by then i knew he did not like me and would say little things to me in chat to make me mad. so i had reasonable rights to assume it was about me because i didn't think he would say it to a person who had just joined like 30 mins ago vs. someone he actually DESPISES (alledgedly). a few minutes later came this screenshot: [Image: IMG_1174.png?ex=6715321e&is=6713e09e&hm=...9c64ab532&]which after talking to mel, i did not see the perspective that maybe he was saying that to correct new people on the server and let them know it wasn't okay. but i think that is a little bit of a stretch because "10/10 would recommend" is a well known meme format and i said afterwards i was joking. and it is worth mentioning to know that other people corrected me too, so he did not even really have to say anything. it 100% was directed to me though, which angered me because the time i said something to him, i got a warning, and for someone who is always saying i harass him and stalk him, to openly say something to me was befuddling. so that queued the argument and we did name call, which we both are wrong for. i meant what i said. i admit that maybe i should have been the bigger person, but in this situation it was days of build up and anger towards each other and we both got it out. i do think there could have been better options, but he had already told people that i was some harasser and ruined what was left of the reputation i had so i figured fuck it we ball. (not a good idea) me and mel also had a conversation about the connotation and denotation of the word cunt, and it is worth mentioning that i said it because where i am from twat is the equivalent of cunt. (so i was trying to even the playing field basically)

2. using discord to circumvent /ignore -
in the one menorah screenshot, i will admit that that is what i did. but to my knowledge after i was warned i cannot remember a time that we had a conversation through discord that i started. i took the warning like a boss, cracked a joke and moved on. from my memory, every other event that has happened through the discord has been because of jorah saying things to me (or me interpreting him as saying it to me). so i do not think that this reason for ban even really applies to me.

3. harass player after being told to stop -
harass is a hefty word that i simply do not have the time to enact. hand to my heart i do not care about jorah or anything that will ever happen to him in the future. i would pull up screenshots, but i do not have access to the discord. he has said multiple times to multiple different people that i have been trying to use discord to bypass the ignore but to be frank, i have used the discord to talk since i first joined the discord. never once have i checked the discord with the thought "what is jorah saying?" because frankly, the world will still spin, and air is still pumping through my lungs. however he has been persistent with telling people that i am harassing him and that is simply not true. a lot of people will believe what he is saying, because i know a lot of people don't like me on the server (i don't like myself all that much either) and because they have known jorah for a much longer time, and he has spent hella money on the server. i understood this when i argued with him and i understood that things would not be in the favor of me and that some mods (no names doe) were already looking for a reason to ban me. i would not "harass" jorah if i thought that that would give you guys the reason. that is not in my character. i don't like lies being spread about me, genuinely. but he will continue to get away with it because i am not a likeable character for some. doesn't bother me though because it didn't concern me until now.

i am sorry for what i did do, that you guys considered wrong. i still have no bad blood for jorah. he is the bane of my existence but i don't mind him, and i am still willing to forgive him if he is willing to forgive me, too. before he /ignored me he was kinda funny. (don't tell him i said that tho)!!

Why do you want to come back: some people (few), i will miss and i did like playing with my friends. i liked jokin around with juan, and building my smurf village and it was a fun experience. and some staff are pretty cool too. overall it was nice to be able to play at the end of the day, and losing that progress lowkey sucks man. (plus the VIP nyx bought for me RIP!) even though not everyone is my friend i don't hate anyone and i never will. 

thanks for hearing me out big dawgs.

RE: Ban Appeal - Nether_Ruler - 10-23-2024

wingedseraph Wrote:Server you were banned on (SMP/Discord): Both  [Image: undecided.png]

Minecraft username: wingedseraph

Reason for your ban (exactly what it says when you try to log in!): name calling, using discord to circumvent /ignore and harass a player after being warned by staff to stop

Who banned you: staff

Why should you be unbanned (Why should we give you a second chance?): okay i got a lot to say so i am going to break this up into 3 different sections to address all things against me.

1. name calling- 
jorah has not liked me for a long time, i do not know exactly why, but i have the screenshots from where it started. at first, he was mad at me for playing around with juan and dorito (he said that it was because they don't like each other) but they are both my friends so i don't know what their hatred for each other has to do with me. here is the screenshots
Screenshot 1
Screenshot 2
in this screenshot, you can see that i thought me and jorah were joking around and i realized that maybe he was not joking around and there were actually hard feelings, so i took the time to apologize and see if he was okay, and if there was bad blood. in return, i was called a twat and was told to leave him alone (which i did!). he ignored me and i did not really care. i did not think he actually hated me, i just thought he was irritable, because i have seen him say rude things to people on the server before and i just left it alone. a while later this screenshot was used against me: screenshot 3
i was told to stop harassing him (which is wack because i work a job and do not have the time to be that invested). and the harassment in question was me seeing his name and saying a joke which i literally just put his name into the song that jewish people sing at hanukkah (love my jewish peeps, amazing song btw). it was 3:56 in the morning and i was high (not an excuse, but an explanation) and tbh i kinda forgot he had me ignored. afterwards i was warned and i took the warning in stride and stopped bothering him. then came this horrid screenshot: screenshot 4 which, at the time, when looked at from an isolated event perspective, to everyone in the chat it did look like i was making it about me. NOT A GOOD LOOK. but by then he had said so many things to me that i kind of jumped the gun and assumed it was about me because by then i knew he did not like me and would say little things to me in chat to make me mad. so i had reasonable rights to assume it was about me because i didn't think he would say it to a person who had just joined like 30 mins ago vs. someone he actually DESPISES (alledgedly). a few minutes later came this screenshot: screenshot 5 which after talking to mel, i did not see the perspective that maybe he was saying that to correct new people on the server and let them know it wasn't okay. but i think that is a little bit of a stretch because "10/10 would recommend" is a well known meme format and i said afterwards i was joking. and it is worth mentioning to know that other people corrected me too, so he did not even really have to say anything. it 100% was directed to me though, which angered me because the time i said something to him, i got a warning, and for someone who is always saying i harass him and stalk him, to openly say something to me was befuddling. so that queued the argument and we did name call, which we both are wrong for. i meant what i said. i admit that maybe i should have been the bigger person, but in this situation it was days of build up and anger towards each other and we both got it out. i do think there could have been better options, but he had already told people that i was some harasser and ruined what was left of the reputation i had so i figured fuck it we ball. (not a good idea) me and mel also had a conversation about the connotation and denotation of the word cunt, and it is worth mentioning that i said it because where i am from twat is the equivalent of cunt. (so i was trying to even the playing field basically)

2. using discord to circumvent /ignore -
in the one menorah screenshot, i will admit that that is what i did. but to my knowledge after i was warned i cannot remember a time that we had a conversation through discord that i started. i took the warning like a boss, cracked a joke and moved on. from my memory, every other event that has happened through the discord has been because of jorah saying things to me (or me interpreting him as saying it to me). so i do not think that this reason for ban even really applies to me.

3. harass player after being told to stop -
harass is a hefty word that i simply do not have the time to enact. hand to my heart i do not care about jorah or anything that will ever happen to him in the future. i would pull up screenshots, but i do not have access to the discord. he has said multiple times to multiple different people that i have been trying to use discord to bypass the ignore but to be frank, i have used the discord to talk since i first joined the discord. never once have i checked the discord with the thought "what is jorah saying?" because frankly, the world will still spin, and air is still pumping through my lungs. however he has been persistent with telling people that i am harassing him and that is simply not true. a lot of people will believe what he is saying, because i know a lot of people don't like me on the server (i don't like myself all that much either) and because they have known jorah for a much longer time, and he has spent hella money on the server. i understood this when i argued with him and i understood that things would not be in the favor of me and that some mods (no names doe) were already looking for a reason to ban me. i would not "harass" jorah if i thought that that would give you guys the reason. that is not in my character. i don't like lies being spread about me, genuinely. but he will continue to get away with it because i am not a likeable character for some. doesn't bother me though because it didn't concern me until now.

i am sorry for what i did do, that you guys considered wrong. i still have no bad blood for jorah. he is the bane of my existence but i don't mind him, and i am still willing to forgive him if he is willing to forgive me, too. before he /ignored me he was kinda funny. (don't tell him i said that tho)!!

Why do you want to come back: some people (few), i will miss and i did like playing with my friends. i liked jokin around with juan, and building my smurf village and it was a fun experience. and some staff are pretty cool too. overall it was nice to be able to play at the end of the day, and losing that progress lowkey sucks man. (plus the VIP nyx bought for me RIP!) even though not everyone is my friend i don't hate anyone and i never will. 

thanks for hearing me out big dawgs.

Alright. I apologize for the length of this response; we have quite a bit to get through. My responses are going to be color-coordinated for ease of correlation. The color in my response responds accordingly with the color in your appeal. The responses are more or less in order unless a color applies to various parts of your appeal.

That being said,

I have little to say about your first interaction with Jorah, besides telling you that if what he said truly bothered you, it should've been addressed then and there. Staff don't police DM's, so if you have an issue with something that is said in one, it's on you to bring it up to one of us so we can deal with it. If someone doesn't like you, that's between you and them. I can't speak for why he doesn't like you, nor do I need to. At the end of the day, the fact is that Jorah dislikes you for whatever reason it may be that he has, and you need to respect that. 

Again, something that should be brought to our attention. Any rudeness you may have witnessed from Jorah is outside the scope of this appeal and is irrelevant.

Correct.

I disagree. What about his statement gives you the impression it was about you? You had said "welcome buddy" and the message from Lester had said "finally | someone recognized my perfect existence." When looking at these two statements alone, which of them could the message "ew" possibly be referring to? The one welcoming a player? Or the one being ecocentric? The entire conversation reads to me like you were looking for reasons to snap at Jorah. That one comment also sparked the entire conversation that ended with your ban from both the server and Discord. Even after that comment, you continued to speak to Jorah:
[Image: ppdr5xj.png]
Not only were you warned to not interact with him since he had you ignored, but you were also openly hostile. Regardless of your previous interactions with him, YOU started this entire conversation. Jorah even asked you again (for the second time) and you responded in a hostile manner:
[Image: 8MfasG6.png]
 
You only mentioned you were joking AFTER everyone had corrected you. Besides, regardless of how popular of a meme format something you say is, the reality is that not everyone is going to understand it's a meme. The age range of our server population is intense. I've met players as young as 6 here, and players who are well into their 70s. As sad as it is to say, not everyone keeps up with memes, and using them to encourage bannable behavior isn't tolerated.

You got a warning because what you said did not correlate with anything. He didn't get a warning because you were saying things that could get other people in trouble and he was correcting you. 

This is something that needs to be addressed. I find it very difficult to understand how you don't think you were harassing Jorah. Not only were you poking him the entirety of the Discord conversation you took screenshots from, but you also found his years-old Twitch AND Discord server linked to it just to start pinging him. In my eyes and the eyes of everyone who reviewed the screenshots, that's harassment. You claim you don't have the time or energy to be harassing someone, but that seems like a pretty targeted activity to me. It was brought to my attention that the Twitch you found was linked to his Discord, but that's still hardly an excuse. If what you're saying is correct, then Jorah /ignored you on October 6th. You joined his Discord on the 13th, well after he ignored you. If you weren't joining to harass him, why? 

Before I continue, I wanted to address this. The amount of money someone has spent on the server, regardless of what you may feel, has nothing to do with whether or not they get banned. Nor, by the way, does someone's relationship with staff on the server. I have banned players who have dropped hundreds of dollars on this server, and one of my first bans was my closest friend at the time. I'm not sure where this notion of "Friends with staff = no ban" is coming from but I'm here to dispel it. 

I again disagree. The entire argument that the two of you had over Discord was, in fact, started by you. 
[Image: Ai83FYs.png]
That message is shortly before this one,
[Image: lJIGzU5.png]
Which then led to the whole back and forth the two of you had. So I'd argue that this reason for your ban DOES apply to you. You even continued to provoke him,
[Image: O7wjHKW.png]
Yes, there were things said on both sides that were inappropriate, but you can't deny the fact that you a) started this entire interaction and b) continued it by poking him. I will not accept the plea of "but he said mean things too!" when you were the one who continued to attack and provoke him. While not right, you can't be shocked that he said something nasty to you back. Throughout the entire interaction, you had people telling you both to chill out and take a step back and yet you refused.
[Image: tIoolry.png]
"This dude won't leave me alone" - you started this interaction. It was begun by you. You are the perpetrator of this instance. Throughout the entire Discord conversation, you were claiming that he started it, but as I've said several times already, that just wasn't the case. 

Someone even suggested that you stop talking to Jorah, to which you responded "you're not a mediator | you can learn when to not speak," a very ironic statement, and you told them to stop talking. It's time you take your own advice and learn when to hold your tongue, since it's the very reason you've gotten into this much trouble in the first place. 
[Image: HGREqkC.png]

If you want the entire conversation to reference since you can't actively access it, you can find it here: https://imgur.com/a/pcHhkva.
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There are a few things I wanted to address that weren't referenced in your appeal. Firstly, reaching out to other players and encouraging them to do a public demonstration on your behalf is both a gross presumption of how we operate and creates an added nuisance for staff. 
[Image: IFmZlnd.png]
You do not need anyone on your side, staff are not looking for a reason to ban you. If we really wanted you gone, there are plenty of rules vague enough that we could have used to justify a ban. Even still, that's not how we work. Staff are not going to like everyone, the same way players aren't going to like all staff. This fact is inevitable, but our team prides itself in not unjustifiably banning others. You were not banned for no reason, and you seem to understand that, so I don't fully understand what makes you feel we were out to get you. Trying to rope others into your mess just makes me suspicious of how you'll change if you get back. It's a super sneaky way of trying to get around a standard process that has been around for as long as this server has (which is more than half your lifetime). It works, and it works for a reason. Of the nearly 2,400 ban appeals on this forums, you'd be hard-pressed to find more than a handful that have bias attached to them.

Next, I want you to know that this ban is not isolated to this instance, at least not in my mind. It was a staff decision to ban you, but since I'm the one responding  I'll go with my reasonings for agreeing to your ban. Jorah is not the only person you hassle. You harassed Pnut after I made the mistake of suggesting they were the one who reported you for making a Diddy joke.

RE: Ban Appeal - Nether_Ruler - 10-24-2024

I have to repost this second part due to editing issues, apologies. 
[Image: fDxvgqS.png]
[Image: yNdG4nC.png]
[Image: qqjmGIB.png]

I understand it's a popular joke right now, but you were politely asked by me to not make jokes about it. There was no reason to go after other players, especially ones who are expressing feelings of discomfort with the things you're saying. I claim partial responsibility for making the mistake of even suggesting who reported you, but that doesn't give you permission to go and harass them over it.

There was also this scenario, which speaks for itself and I don't feel the need to comment on all that much: https://imgur.com/a/EmDLIpD. It's one thing to make a joke, it's another thing to beat the metaphorical horse dead and keep beating it waaaaay longer than it needs to be. This is also the situation that caused Jorah to dislike you in the first place if your screenshots are anything to go off of.

I could find you plenty of other scenarios if I felt like spending more time on this response than I already have, but I'm sure you get the gist. You tend to poke and poke and poke and poke players and then cry victim when they finally snap. This type of behavior cannot continue. It's a nuisance to both other players and the staff who have to deal with it. It's one thing to banter with your friends, but to hassle people who you aren't close with and who aren't comfortable with it is another. 

I usually give questions for players to answer at the end of an appeal response, but I'm electing to leave this one open-ended for you.

RE: Ban Appeal - wingedseraph - 10-25-2024

OKAY! i have been busy with life but now I have time to respond and I will say this: if i am not unbanned give my assets to juan (money and property please lol, he's the only one i trust). now i will address some things said:

1. if what happened between me and jorah that we didn't bring to you is irrelevant, why are you and dorito leaking my dms with dorito (which was devastating to hear, because that was the first time i wished good on someone in a long time, and i will never do it again.) not only was leaking dms an invasion of my privacy, but completely inappropriate as you left out half of them and it is rude to me to do that and honestly leads me to think that dorito has probably told ALL the staff everything else i have said to dorito which is a little bit painful because i trusted him with a lot of information. besides that BLATANT AND AWFUL stab in the back, what i meant in the screenshot was that it would have meant something to me if dorito said something because even though HE talked about all of you guys behind your back and was on his way to finding a new server, his opinion was still valued. tooken WAY out of context.

2. bringing up me saying "i know what you did" to pnut is not only NOT harrassment, but completely ignorant to the situation and has nothing to do what i was banned for. i was also joking and it wouldn't have surprised me if it was dorito who did that and not pnut. yes it was your fault as a mod for telling me who reported me, and this would not have happened if you did not do that. if pnut thought it was harrassment, they could have came to me, and i would have sorted it accordingly.

3. "i understand it is a popular joke, but you were asked politely by me to not make jokes about it". not only do i not remember that (not saying it didn't happen, in reference to the xray jokes) but if you did then i am sorry. if you did not then i am not sorry because it is not against the rules to make jokes and the only people who told me to stop were non-mods who definitely could use the /ignore command.

4. pnut also said i tried to "constantly message" them about the pdiddy joke, and i did not, i have never messaged pnut privately. i do not even know if pnut is a boy or a girl. i don't know this person outside of saying "i know what you did" twice.

5. "we are not looking for a reason to ban you". wellll i would say using screenshots from September and pulling private messages would be finding fuel to add to the fire, but i digress. you have to at least admit that there is a reason why i believe that you guys are. cmon man lol

6. "you are the perpetrator". in the 2 separate occasions in that one night, the first one was started by me when i thought jorah was talking to me, and the second one was jorah responding to me, which is circumventing /ignore because i have him ignored aswell.

7. yes i did join his discord server! i do take responsibility for joining his discord and saying "hello jorah" (which i wonder why you didn't mention that that is all i said in the discord. makes me think.). i don't consider this harassment though, but if you do, sure. i did it. but loosely using the word harassment takes away from the meaning of the word. it was public on his discord (which i did not look up bee tee dubs) and i thought it would be funny (not an excuse, but an explanation. i do take full responsibility for this.

the takeaway is, i do take responsibility for what i did. sure. but i will not let you pull out of context dms and 2 text messages from september to use to make me seem like a horrible person to whoever will read this post. that is a poor and UNTRUE display of my character. sure, i love a good time and to joke around and i have gotten into this one predicament but that does not mean you can leak my messages publicly (regardless of what they say).

to dorito, if you see this, i did trust you with information and that is a mistake i will never make again. leaking my messages and whichever other ones you've showed and broadcasted says more about you than me.

i do think what i said to jorah could have been done better, but i will continue to be an advocate for myself and my character.

goodnight peeps.

RE: Ban Appeal - Nether_Ruler - 10-27-2024

1. My "irrelevant" comment was referencing you saying that you've witnessed Jorah being rude to other players before, not regarding your DMs with him. My point about your DMs with him was that if you had any issue with it, the DM should have been brought to us. I said, "if what he said truly bothered you, it should've been addressed then and there. Staff don't police DM's, so if you have an issue with something that is said in one, it's on you to bring it up to one of us so we can deal with it." Which, the way I see it, is exactly what Dorito did. I apologize if you feel that posting your DM was an invasion of your privacy, but I did it with the full consent of Dorito, which was enough for me. Aside from that, regardless of how you feel about it, what you say you meant by your message was exactly my point of what is not allowed. Asking players to advocate on your behalf about a ban is not permitted, no matter the context in which you meant it. Whether that's messaging staff asking to get unbanned, logging onto the server with an alt, or asking a player to do a demonstration, none of it is allowed. 

In reference to Dorito's opinion still being valued: I was not aware that he talked behind our backs, but honestly, I don't see how that pertains to this situation, nor am I sure what "opinion" of Dorito's you think we took into consideration. He forwarded a message, nothing more. Anything I took from the message was based on its contents, not anything Dorito said. However, if you feel that I somehow missed something in the screenshot that I used, you are more than welcome to defend it, that's the point of this appeal. I am not stopping you from bringing your own screenshots here to defend yourself (or even directly messaged to me, if you aren't comfortable posting them here). However, until I see any proof that what you said was taken out of context and there's more to the situation than I could see, I'm going to use the evidence that I have presented to me. 

For the rest of the stuff you mentioned about Dorito, it's out of my scope to discuss, since it's about your relationship with him, but he did want to say something about it.
(For clarification's sake, Dorito gave me his express consent to post this message on his behalf). 
[Image: ma5C79U.png]
I'm unsure why you felt the need to throw Dorito under the bus by mentioning that he talked behind our backs, but I want it known that it's pretty well known that a lot of players talk behind our backs. As I mentioned in my first reply, not everyone is going to like us, and that's ok. Players are going to be frustrated by our decisions, and that is ok. Most people have no idea 95% of the stuff that goes on behind the scenes, all they see is what they want to see, and that is ok. It's a bummer it happens, but it's not a shock and it's also not an issue that needs to be resolved or settled here. 

2. I'm not going to argue the semantics over the definition of harassment. The fact of the matter is, you made a player feel uncomfortable, and that's enough. You saying it wasn't the reason you were banned is a poor excuse, and does not make it right or ok. It was used as an example of you hassling other players (if harassment is too strong a word). You're allowed to joke, and no one is stopping you from doing so, but the jokes need to be appropriate and aimed at the right audience. It would have been different if Dorito made the joke. Dorito and Pnut are friends, and that's the contrast. Was I partially to blame for suggesting to you that Pnut reported you? Yes. Does it excuse your behavior or absolve you from blame? Absolutely not. You still made the conscious decision to confront them about it, and I made the conscious mistake of trusting you with information you couldn't be trusted with. Pnut did not go to you because they did not want to interact with you. Pnut came to me, and I offered to do something about it, to which they declined. 

3. When I mentioned you were asked politely not to make jokes about it, I was referencing the Diddy stuff, not the x-ray joke. I hadn't known about the x-ray joke conversation until I was writing out my response to your appeal. It is not against the rules to make jokes, but it's against the rules to be a nuisance. Several people were telling you it was annoying, and the fact that they're not staff shouldn't change that. Staff can not, and should not, be expected to be online 24/7 to hold the hands of players who don't know when a joke has gone too far. Sometimes other players know what's up, and you're allowed to listen to what they say. Just because they're not staff doesn't mean you should disregard their opinions. Should non-staff be acting in the role of staff? No. But at least have the decency to realize (or if not realize, then listen when someone tells you) when you're pushing it and being a disturbance to the peace of other players. They could have used /ignore, absolutely, but the existence of /ignore does not give everyone else the right to be a botheration.

4. I'm not sure where Pnut mentioned that you tried to constantly message them, nor can I find anywhere either of us said that. 

5. Your first screenshots with your DMs with Jorah are from the beginning of October (the 6th), so I'm not sure how my using a screenshot from 11 days before that is that much of a stretch. It's not like I'm digging back years here. You joined the server a bit over a month ago (September 15th). As for the private messages. Ignoring the fact that you also used private messages without the permission of both individuals, the one I used was also completely relevant to the situation. I apologize if you feel targeted, and I can see how you feel that way, don't get me wrong, but I want you to know that this isn't the case. The reason I'm showing you all these conversations is not to pull a "gotcha!" and shove it in your face, but to try and help you understand how you've affected other people and how the things you say that may be funny to you aren't to others. We were not looking for a reason to ban you, but we are going to use everything we have to justify your ban, the same way you can use everything you have to defend it. 

6. Not entirely true. The first occasion (the first instance of you addressing Jorah) was here:
[Image: 1uxFeHA.png]
It was after this that the first instance you mentioned (of you responding to Jorah when you thought he was talking to you) happened, which then devolved into a whole discussion. There was then a short break, and then Jorah mentioned to not grief because you said something about it as a joke. Honestly, I would argue that he wasn't even talking to you, just mentioned to not grief because it could get someone else banned, but that's neither here nor there. Yes, he commented to you afterward about you stalking him. Was it right? Absolutely not. Did he face consequences for his actions? Yes. I'm not here to defend what he said. What he said was wrong, and it was appropriately addressed in his appeal. 

7. I mentioned that you started pinging him on his server. That is the information that I was given, and it is the information that I mentioned in my first reply, "but you also found his years-old Twitch AND Discord server linked to it just to start pinging him." As with the Dorito situation, if you would like to present something to me that proves otherwise, or explain the situation further, you'll find I am very receptive. I'm not sure how you concluded that I intentionally left something out ("which i wonder why you didn't mention that that is all i said in the discord. makes me think."), since I've been nothing but open this entire process, but do keep in mind that I'm not purposefully occluding information to shine you in a worse light. If you feel that harassment is too strong of a word, I'm happy to use another one. How's provocation?

"the takeaway is, i do take responsibility for what i did. sure. but i will not let you pull out of context dms and 2 text messages from september to use to make me seem like a horrible person to whoever will read this post. that is a poor and UNTRUE display of my character. sure, i love a good time and to joke around and i have gotten into this one predicament but that does not mean you can leak my messages publicly (regardless of what they say)."

Are you even taking responsibility for what you did? The only thing you admitted doing and didn't defend was joining Jorah's Discord server, and even that was under the pretense of "If you consider this harassment, then yeah I guess I did it." 

As for making you out to be a horrible person, the only screenshot I used that I did not share the entire conversation was that screenshot that Dorito sent me since I don't have access to the entire thing. That is also the only private message I used against you. Everything else I either showed or linked in its entirety and can also be found publicly through #server-chat. So if you feel like you're being made out to be a horrible person, I fail to see how that's my doing. 

Regarding sharing your message with Dorito, the only way to say this is to say it bluntly: anything you say can be shared. Nothing is stopping anyone from screenshotting everything you have ever said to them and sharing it publicly. Does it diminish trust? Sure. Is it a crappy thing to do in the wrong context? Definitely. But I'm not going to take the excuse of "it was private, and you can't share my private conversations." I do my best to be as polite as possible when sharing DMs, I asked Dorito if I could use that screenshot, but at the end of the day the fact of the matter is the only right to privacy you have is choosing what you decide to put into writing.

Aside from all that, isn't your point about not sharing DMs with another player a little hypocritical? The very start of your appeal is sharing DMs that you had with Jorah. You did not have his permission to do so. So, either DMs can be shared as long as one person consents to it, or they can't be shared at all. You can't come at me for doing something when you did the very same.

Again, if you think there's more context to that DM to Dorito that would shine you in a better light if you shared, please feel free. The messages from September are completely relevant, and the excuse of "Oh it happened last month!" is a poor one at best, and completely extraneous at worst. You do not decide the duration of evidence I am allowed to present, and even if you were, a conversation string from less than half a month ago is perfectly reasonable to be shared. As I mentioned before, it's not like I'm digging through years of stuff here just to throw in your face. People change over time, yes, but a thread from a bit over a month ago isn't a stretch whatsoever. 

"i do think what i said to jorah could have been done better, but i will continue to be an advocate for myself and my character."

I actively encourage you to advocate for yourself, and you're 100% right that what you said to Jorah could've been done better (or better yet, not at all).

RE: Ban Appeal - wingedseraph - 10-27-2024

1. it doesn't matter what was "enough for you" because point blank, you shouldn't have done it. DMS i shared with jorah were on the minecraft server that you can already see because you're a mod. ones on discord are encrypted. so i don't know how you came to that conclusion.

2. but how does what i said to pnut have anything to do with anything now? it was completely irrelevant. pnut ignored me and that is okay. i have not bothered pnut since, and that isn't even relevant to the situation. also the screenshot where pnut said i was constantly messaging them was in a screenshot you posted, but i actually cannot post screenshots in quick replies.

3. i didn't make another diddy joke, so i don't see how that is important either. i stopped when you told me to stop smh. look through the chats (public ones).

4. so pulling up things that happened 11 days before the jorah stuff in a jorah related ban appeal is related? mmkkayy then lol. i haven't even spoken to pnut since september, there is no bad blood between us that i know of.

5. it isn't just the pictures that you are sharing to shine me in a bad light, because out of context a few of them do look whack but they are true. it is the words and descriptions you are using to make things sound worse than they are. "years-old twitch AND discord server" uh yeah, they're in his discord bio LINKED. you act as if i found his mothers facebook. it took 2 clicks. it is not the denotation but the connotation of how you say things, which makes them sound worse than they are to someone who does not know me.

6. "if you consider this harassment, then yeah i guess i did it" NEVER said that. if that's what you took from what i said then put your glasses on and read it again. I said i did it. never said "i guess i did it", nor gave the impression that i was shifting blame. I DID IT!!! i never said i didn't. I did say I don't consider it harassment. I did not do ALL of the things you accused me of, but i did what i admitted to, and i said i probably would have done it differently. i do want the credit if i am winning or losing, but i will NOT take credit for what i did not do. I did say I was sorry for what I did do, though.

7. "the only right to privacy you have is choosing what you decide to do in writing". that is wrong AF! and i hope that one day someone you trust does your messages how you did mine so you understand how twisted that statement is, because I don't think you have the empathy to do so yourself.

8. i did not say i decided the duration of "evidence", however if this were in court, they would dismiss it, because it is not close to applicable in this situation.

and i will continue to advocate for myself. whether or not you think what i said sounds mean or not, i would rather tell you the truth and speak how i actually feel. i said i was sorry for what i did do, and i owned up for what i did, but you have to understand that however it may come off, i do not believe in letting you disrespect me in the way of pulling absolutely any card in the book to make your point. the dorito dms and pnut situation have nothing to do with my ban appeal, as that is not what i am appealing for. and i did not tell you that dorito talks behind your back to denounce you or dorito, but for you to understand that if he played me, he will play us both. be careful who you keep as company.

thank ya for reading this all (if you did) nether wifey

RE: Ban Appeal - Nether_Ruler - 10-29-2024

Okay, I'm going to broadly address a few things that you said since I feel we're getting off track with this appeal. Instead of getting anywhere, we're just arguing semantics and throwing around thinly veiled insults.

First, I understand your frustration with my sharing a DM that you had, but you're acting as if I spilled your deepest darkest secrets to the world. I shared an isolated instance of you breaking our rules that another player felt needed to be addressed (and was correct in feeling so). It does not matter whether the DM was on the server or over Discord. Personally, I see very little difference. I don't really wish to argue this point anymore. What's done is done, and it's a part of your appeal that does need to be addressed. 

Second, pulling up things that happened 11 days before the Jorah stuff in a Jorah-related appeal is related. It is not why you're banned, correct, and I'm not asking you to defend it. The reason I showed all the extra stuff was to make the point that Jorah is not the only player who feels hassled by you. That is all.

Third, to address this point: "6. "if you consider this harassment, then yeah i guess i did it" NEVER said that. if that's what you took from what i said then put your glasses on and read it again. I said i did it. never said "i guess i did it", nor gave the impression that i was shifting blame. I DID IT!!! i never said i didn't. I did say I don't consider it harassment."
Here is a quote from your first reply to me:
"i don't consider this harassment though, but if you do, sure. i did it."
What you say you didn't say is more or less exactly what you said, unless I'm misreading something, or my glasses are just foggy.

Fourth, to address this: "7. "the only right to privacy you have is choosing what you decide to do in writing". that is wrong AF! and i hope that one day someone you trust does your messages how you did mine so you understand how twisted that statement is, because I don't think you have the empathy to do so yourself.
Insulting me not going to get this appeal anywhere. I've made my mistakes in the past, such as the one I made trusting you, and I learn from each mistake. I know who to put my trust in. I know who I can confide in and who's going to share every word I type with them. Perhaps I'm just cynical. I'd also like to reiterate that I shared a very small blurb of a message you sent to another player. I didn't share anything private that was unrelated to this appeal (and the DM is related to this appeal since asking players to create demonstrations on your behalf is blatantly against the rules). 

Fifth, and finally: and i will continue to advocate for myself. whether or not you think what i said sounds mean or not, i would rather tell you the truth and speak how i actually feel. i said i was sorry for what i did do, and i owned up for what i did, but you have to understand that however it may come off, i do not believe in letting you disrespect me in the way of pulling absolutely any card in the book to make your point. the dorito dms and pnut situation have nothing to do with my ban appeal, as that is not what i am appealing for. and i did not tell you that dorito talks behind your back to denounce you or dorito, but for you to understand that if he played me, he will play us both. be careful who you keep as company.
You are welcome to advocate for yourself, and I continue to encourage you to do so. I'm not sure I count insulting me as advocating for yourself though. Regardless, contrary to your belief, the Dorito PM is incredibly relevant to your appeal for reasons I already explained, and I expect you to address it in the questions I am about to pose to you. The Pnut situation is also relevant, as that example was used as ways you hassle other players. Whether Dorito will play us both is a concept that does not need to be figured out here and now. He already addressed why he shared that message with me in the screenshot I shared in my previous reply. 

(Also, for clarification, I read everything you say in its entirety).

All that being said, I don't wish to engage in semantical discussions about each of the points I just made. If you truly feel strongly about something, you're welcome to reply to it, and I can't stop you, but I'm no longer going to defend myself. We're going to have to agree to disagree on some of the things brought up, but I am not going to accept being villainized for doing what is expected of me. 

Instead of leaving it open-ended, I'm going to pose to you a series of questions. You've been putting effort into your responses, which I appreciate, and I'd like to encourage you to put an equal amount of thought and effort into this next response of yours. 1-2 sentences likely won't cut it. After you respond to these questions, this appeal will be forwarded to the rest of the team for discussion and decision. 

I apologize for not doing this off the bat, as I'm sure this appeal would've been much more productive if I had done so. 20/20 hindsight I suppose.

1. How do you plan on handling disagreements/conflicts with other players in the future?
2. Why does the /ignore command exist? How should players respond if someone chooses to /ignore them? How did bypassing /ignore in your case affect others?
3. Why is it essential to respect the boundaries other players set, even if you think they're being unfair or sensitive? how would continuing to ignore these boundaries affect other players?
4. If warned again by staff, how will you respond to ensure you avoid falling into this situation again?
5. Why do you think the server has a rule against harassment, and how do you believe breaking this rule could impact the enjoyment of other players on the server? If unbanned, what will you do differently to ensure that your interactions remain within respectful boundaries?
6. Why do we disallow players advocating for other players' unbans?

RE: Ban Appeal - frost - 10-29-2024

Honestly reading what has happened and the chats exchanged I regret that this was even let long enough for so many people to see such aggression from you towards other members. This entire appeal, despite there being so many words, is full of deflections, justifications, and has nearly zero accountability or apologies from you. Your words and actions affected not just the people mentioned in this thread, but the community as a whole and those that had the misfortune of being online when you were spouting this hate. This could have ended after you were ignored and no one would be banned, but you chose to take it another level and continue your harassment in multiple forms.

You were given a chance to appeal and show the community that you understood why you were banned and to show us that you are capable of being a positive person in this community, but instead I only see justifications of your actions and deflections of blame. I hope you take this into consideration for your next reply if you choose to do so, because there is no room for someone so capable of this behavior in this community.

RE: Ban Appeal - wingedseraph - 10-29-2024

i was under the impression that this was a civil discussion. i do understand that my behavior has been unsettling for some, and although i hold no grudges to anyone, i did forget to apologize (i didn't know i was supposed to get to that part of the form yet mb). i am sorry to those who i may have made uncomfortable, that was not my intentions. and i will answer your questions however i do understand your decision not to have me on the server. here are my answers to the questions:

1. i probably will not say anything and just leave it be cause i am tired of arguing (it does get tiring and repetitive) and my replies do tend to escalate things so i will just not respond, and pay them no mind, or use /ignore. if it continues past that i will not hesitate to get a mod involved.
2. in my case it effected others by making jorah angry and me angry and people who witnessed uncomfortable. this was not necessary for jorah or me, and would've saved us both a lot of time and energy. 
3. because not only would i not want people doing it to me, but everyone has different experiences and definitions, and something that may not make sense to me will make total sense to them and vice versa, and when you continue it creates a situation that is not fun for either sides and can be avoided.
4. it won't happen again, but in the hypothetical that it does, honestly speaking i will probably leave the server, because i do not want to have to write another one of these forum posts, and it would save you guys the trouble too, because i am sure it is taxing to you, because it is taxing to me.
5. because nobody wants to be bothered while just trying to play minecraft, it can cause mental stress for some, too. this causes a negative outlook on the server for people who are just trying to have a good time, and then it becomes other people's problems as well. 
6. i understand this one, too. it would just cause conflict and most times they are banned for a good reason. it will also not help them get unbanned. tbf i did not think it would be taken as seriously as it was, because it was Juan, but I won't do it again. 10g was banned for an understandable reason, though it would be nice to see him back so i can apologize for stealing his paintings that one day.

and frost, i am sure you could tell this was my first ban appeal. i've never done this before. i didn't know the part where i was supposed to take accountability had already passed. i do take accountability and i do apologize. i am a human like you and i make mistakes.

with all this considered there is still no hate harbored for jorah, or frost, or nether, or mel, or anyone else involved. even the peeps in the chat that told me to stop. all good on my end. thanks for hearing me out again big dawgs and nether wifey.

(updated replies)

RE: Ban Appeal - frost - 10-29-2024

I'll let nether continue this discussion, but I did just want to clarify that when I said 'I regret that this was even let long enough for so many people to see,' I was actually referring to you not being banned quicker when you started using server-chat to bypass Jorah's /ignore since a lot of people on the server and on discord were asking you to stop or were silently uncomfortable at the words exchanged at the time. This appeal is a civil discussion and that comment was not judging what you've said in the appeal.

The time to take accountability or apologize has not passed, but I was just voicing my concern and disappointment that while there have been many messages and words exchanged here, no where did you actually show accountability or acceptance of your actions. Instead you continually explain or justify the actions in any way possible.

I understand that this is your first appeal, but at the end of the day Jorah correctly /ignored you and took the step to avoid conflict and you chose to bypass it in any way you could to continually harass and bully him in many different ways and methods of communication. The texts exchanged were extremely aggressive towards him and also caused discomfort to others in the community with even younger players asking you to stop. To me there is not really any justification in that act and I was surprised to see zero apology or accountability regarding that. I was not looking for any justification or excuses for this behavior as to me it seems pretty black and white.

This appeal was meant for you to show the community that you are not that type of person that would do that. That you recognized this action was an emotional act that could be avoided because deep down you aren't that kind of person who gets enjoyment from doing this. That you recognize and acknowledge the hurt you could have inflicted onto Jorah and others involved and you show remorse in doing so. We have no room for bullies or people that cannot recognize and acknowledge their own poor actions. I was really hoping this was a mistake and that you were not one of those people and could be a positive player in this community, but am having trouble seeing that in this discussion.